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When is this big rebalance happening?

Also related, did Niantic come to their senses and realize that gyms don't need to be easier to take down? The gym scene is already a big yawn.

Asked by Patcallo25 years 5 months ago
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by lirsen 5 years 5 months ago

the problem is not gyms but pvp, if the life/defense value continued like currently blissey would dominate (and make absolutely boring) the PVP scene

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They probably want to change gyms so we have to get new top defenders and new top attackers, after so long we all have armies of machamp and blissey. They make the gym system change, see what becomes the best counter, then make that a raid boss so people have to shell out tons o raid passes to get the best ones they can

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Blissey and Chansey will still be the defenders with the slowest time to beat.

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Slowest time to beat with perfect counters yes, but not everyone has perfect counters for other pokemon that have high bulk. Players have armies of machamp maxed out specifically for blissey. By putting in other defenders that arent weak to the same type or less common weaknesses they will take longer to beat either because you need to spend more time at team selection, healing after battles or because those counters arent as high leveled are slower to beat. the faster time to beat is assuming all else equal, perfect counters at best movesets and max level, which rarely exists for anything outside of machamp or specific legendary counters for the most hardcore players. most casuals dont have anything other than high leveled machamp because of blissey.

Having chansy take a hit defensively speaking (around 20% in hp, and around 25% in defense from what it seems) thats substantial, subbing it out for something else thats not fighting weak will take longer to beat because you need to being something with different type effectiveness. More type diverse gyms do take longer to take down, but only the in battle time is shorter.

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If that were true and there are better mons to put in gyms then why not put them in now? Why do we need stats completely overhauled just to tell us blissey are lame? Gym battles are boring because we make them boring. Because we are told that if you go to a gym without a blissey in it and you put in anything other than a blissey then you are not playing correctly.

We don't put blissey in gyms because it's optimal we put them in because it's easy. We don't have to think about it. Just like how we use the "recommended" team in tier 5 raids. It's easier and who cares

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You're thinking it backwards. We use Blissey in the first place because it's the best all around defender, with high TDO and high survivability, forcing long battles, period. The next ones are Chansey, Snorlax and Slaking (provided that last one is high motivation). Except if you put all 4, you end up with a very specialized defensive team which is easier to beat than a mixed types defensive team. In other words, the best defensive team is not composed of the 6 best individual defenders, but of 2-3 of the best ones coupled with some of the #5 to #15 maybe defenders who have types and attacks complemeting the weaknesses of the top ones. That is the best defensive team.

We do put Blissey in gyms because it's the best defender. It's what we put after it that makes the gym scene dull. The rebalance reduces the gap between the top 3 and other defenders so it's more relevant to use others. And I didn't do the math but even if Blissey is probably still #1, I'm not sure about Chansey and Snorlax still being in the top 3 after the rebalance.

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I have always failed to see why people place slaking in gyms. They scream attack me because of the high cp and ease of being mowed down

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Very high CP is a deterrent for a large portion of attackers, some anaware of Slaking special fast move. Plus, many people don't dodge, so a play rough Slaking actually makes sense

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Play Rough is hard to dodge.

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Which makes Slaking even more interesting :) I mean some people don't even try so you're 100% sure they'll get hit full force by the defender's move. When you try to dodge a tricky move, at least you have a chance of success.

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Even after the stat rebalance happens, Blissey will still be the best defender. She ends up losing about 60 points of defense, but really doesn't lose much HP at all (a maxed Blissey can still clear over 400 HP). The only difference is Blissey will be top-tier and not god-tier in gym defense.

The best gym lineups will still be a Blissey, Chansey, and probably Snorlax with Mons placed in between them that wall Machamps (like Gardevoir, Dragonite, eventually Togekiss, etc). That combination includes all the elements of what you want in gym defense: a prolonged TTW for the attacker, the likelihood of using up multiple potions, and forcing them to swap Mons after each battle. The stat rebalance really won't change that much, at all.

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You said it yourself : probably Snorlax. Before the rebalance, lineups were Blissey-Chansey-Snorlax-Slaking and then often Dragonite, Milotic, some psychic, Tyranitar, Salamence. After the rebalance, Blissey will probably still the best defender but maybe Snorlax and Chansey won't be that interesting any longer and we might see more diversity in the gym lineups. That depends on the performance Chansey and Snorlax have in gyms after the rebalance (or the performance prople think they have).

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When they fix the HP bug. They'll probably need another game update including bug fixes before this happens. Maybe next week.

They know gyms are boring. They know..

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As i said from day 1 of the new gym system, they simply replaced one turd with another. Instead of a boring gym system that rewarded spoofers and the players with the strongest pokemon, you've got a boring gym system that is zero challenge and has no meta (aside from boring blisseys.) The only decent thing about it is the gold medals you can earn.

In answer to the OPs other question, the big rebalance did go live. For about 15 minutes :D

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IMO nerf Blissey and Chansey or lessen the availability of golden razz. I fight the gyms I fight going to work or coming home from work. GRB are absurdly plentiful, they are generally unnecessary to catch 90% of the raid bosses people actually try to catch.

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They could potentially spice up the gym scene with the stat rebalance along with some sort of out-there ideas.

Remove remote berrying - doesn’t make sense. Am I just chucking this berry into my Pokémon’s mouth from miles away?

Remove motivation decay - if you can’t feed remotely, it will be easier to take gyms anyway without the cp draining
OR
Bring back some form of prestiging gyms. Start out low, the more/better Pokémon placed in the gym gets stronger. If you’re gold in the gym maybe your Pokémon gets a buff or something. Allow people to train in the gyms as a way to regain decayed cp from time or battles

Make gym defenders like raid bosses - not necessarily strong ones, just stronger than normal. Then there could be rewards for winning gym battles.

Allowing legendaries in gyms. Either outright or with rules.
Maybe one legendary per gym.
Maybe only if you’re gold in the gym.
Maybe only if there’s 6 Pokémon in, the legendary is the gyms “boss” - could even be the teams mascot that doesn’t belong to an actual player

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