I see a lot of discussion about good movesets for different defenders in the gym. What's the point? It's not really that you leave the gym alone if you meet a Snorlax with ZH/HB instead of Lick/EQ. Defenders just stand there like Arnold Schwarzenegger and happily receives everything you blast away.
For defenders nothing but IV matters. You can put in any Rhydon you want as long as it´s CP offers a decent spot in the gym.
High IV Dnites with SW/HB will gather much more coins than a medium IV DT/OR at the same level. Gym position is everything, moveset is nothing.
Part of the fun of the game is analyzing and maximizing the mons capabilities.
But I have to admit.. you're pretty much correct. If I go after a gym, it doesn't matter what moves the defender has. I adjust for them immediately, and certainly have the resources to battle whatever is in the gym.
Although I'll still (maybe) pass by a friendly gym with a Blissey on bottom and 10000 prestige to go.
My ZH/DG Blissey that allows much weaker mons above it to collect coins for longer will disagree.
On many occasions I have had to go back to her gym to train it up so others can add to the gym again, once players have removed everything below it, but got stuck by my big pink lady with a good moveset.
My Zh/Psychic Blisseys don't provide the same protection.
Sure those above her get coins because of their position above my Blissey...but it is my Blissey's moveset that protects them and enables them to be secure.
Although I agree to a certain extent, there is benefit in ensuring your mons are optimal.
I have not been stopped either. I have never run into a gym I can't take down...as long as I have the time.
However, it seems that is not the case for all players. The gym I mention is real. It has fallen a couple of times and I go and claim it back...but 4 times in the last 10 days I have seen the gym go to lvl10 and then fall back to level5 - the position of my Blissey, and then stopped. So I train against my Blissey and leave a couple of free spots and the gym goes to lvl10 again. Rinse and repeat.
It may just be a coincidence and they ran out of time/potions but 4 times in 10 days is enough for me to think she is the common denominator.
You must not do very much gym battling. As someone who has done lots of battling, fighting a gym full of 'mons with the right movesets will put a substantial dent in my potions and revives. So if you are attempting to take down two L10 gyms back to back, you pray that you'll face sub optimal movesets on those Snorlaxes and Blisseys.
What 's the point of taking down a couple of lvl 10 gyms if don't have a bunch of friends with you to build them up? If you have a bunch of friends with you you won´t lose that much potions.
I've pretty much stopped battling, just prestiging gyms of level 6-9 where I can put in a mon at a decent level. Since I'm level 29 that pretty much means Dnites and T-rex. No meaning in wasting potions in gyms where spoofers just take them back in a minute.
High IV Dnites or high CP Dnites? For example, an average IV dnite might be very high on defense and HP IVs, and trash on attack, but the moveset "may" influence the trainers decision to max it as a defender. This suggests a very nuanced approach to powering up. Anyway, to get the point. I fought 3 lvl 10 gyms today, three on my own, taking all down. The two I fought alone were mostly Dragonites, along with a Snolax or two, and a couple of Gyarados. Everything was about 2.9-3k or higher. Within that equation I have a 3.4k Dnite with DBreath and Dclaw, and I can generally take out 2-3 Dnites at 3k or over with that mon, but the killer is a Dnite with DTail and Outrage, if it gets it charge move off. It suggests to me that not all movesets are equal by any means. Your assessment that gym position is everything is true only to the extent that the attacker must have, through attrition, worked through the gym to get to the Gym position you assume, and some movesets may only hinder, actually impede, or put off the assault. Your example of the Rhydon is useful. Megahorn is hardly ideal, as is Gyarados with Twister, but in the war of attrition in taking down the gym they play a role. The point, however, is that for the determined and fully potioned up attacker, some movesets are less useful than others, which exposes even the highest gym level to attack sooner, or later.
I guess OP just went through a lot of evolution failures (such as getting SW/HB Dnite) and came here to rant. The conclusion is so extreme that it sounds ridiculous.
To start with, as long as there is a difference, which indeed is as many have already pointed out, you cannot say "moveset is nothing". This difference can accumulate by the number of defenders in gyms, the number of gyms, and the days you play the game! Fighting 1,000 ZH/BS Snorlax is the same as fighting 1,000 Lick/Eq one?
And if your conclusion holds, then why are we seeing Blisseys in gyms, instead of 100% Dragonite, Rhydon, Tyranitar or Gyarados? All of them 4 have higher CP than Blissey and give higher gym position. BTW, there are gyms, according to my observations, which consist of only Dnite/Tyranitar, and they are occupied by spoofers who have little knowledge about the game. I don't assume OP is one of them, or should I?
Of course, gym position matters, but if you only focus on that then basically you have zero fun playing the game - you just look at that number and nothing more. Everyone knows how to compare CP as long as they know primary school math, but not everyone knows how to compare defenders with different move sets.
Even though saying "moveset is nothing" is a bit extreme I can go along with it to some extent. I hardly ever encounter dratinis in the wild. So when I got my first SW/HB dragonite (with 82%IV) I could have just said "useless" and left it. Instead I powered it up as I went along and hatched or caught more dratinis and it earned me a lot of gold and dust. So it certainly wasn't useless. I decided very early on not to take any notice of the "best" moves but to just make do with what I have. I do not use trackers and do not cheat and then it is not so easy to "just get a better one" as lots of people here suggest all the time. It took till gen 2 for me to get a second Dragonite. Best moveset, fantastic IVs. Sure it is better but I would have used it even with the worst moveset. Following my own strategy I have steadily been getting gold and dust from being in gyms. Apart from that, today's bad moves could be tomorrow's best moves. For instance I powered up my Golem with rock moves (for no other reason than the fact that I got him first and loved his attack animation). Now it seems I suddenly have a powered up mon with the best moveset without doing anything for it. So yes IV and CP just as important as moves in my opinion.
Also I had a Chansey ready and waiting all powered up. So my Blissey was by far the strongest defender I had. There weren't that many high CP ones around here when gen 2 came out. Funnily enough it was kicked out off gyms more than any other of my Pokemon. I think everyone just wanted to fight the Blissey:)
Ranting? Spoofer? Gimme a break. The only thing that matters is to put your mon above the Blissey in the gym and only a few will manage that if the Blissey is around 3k. Then the moveset doesn't matter.
Most people would like to stay in the gym as long as possible and to do that you should max CP. Look at Gyarados. At lvl 30 it can have anything between CP 2500 and 2900. The former is useless regardless of moves and the latter will sometimes manage a spot at number 9 or 10 in the gym.
People wich just put any pokemon in the gym just because it has high cp is the problem, that is why some gyms are just weaker
That is why you play with your friends and put pokemons useful in gyms so can last longer or people will just not like want to go, get blisseys with ZH and DG, Snorlax with ZH and body slam, Vaporeons with Aqua tail, etc
it does matter, its so different attacking a gym with a bunch of rhydons than a bunch of snorlax, is very different attacking a gym with a bunch of snorlax with lick and hb than bunch of snorlax with zh and body slam...soooo different, so moveset matters so you can annoy the attacker and make him use more pots and revives or just not be able to take it down because his mobs dying, its for maximize the potential of a pokemon standing like terminator in the gym
You just said it, pokemons in gyms are controlled by AI, so atleast put the best pokemons with the best movesets for maximize the level 10 annoying gym
Move sets may not deter the most determined to take down a gym, but they drain extra resources like potions and revives and that can mean taking time out to gather such things before hitting other of your gyms or coming back to battle. No one who really wants to take a gym will be denied, but using good defenders makes the siege as painful and costly as possible.
