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Gen 4 Defending Meta

You thought Gen 3 was the worst? At least it brought in the facade Slaking, the Dragon slayer Milotic, Metagross, and a couple other B-D Tier Defenders. Gen 4 is even worse.

Togekiss: May be the only worthwhile defender in the Gen, it walls Dragons and Machamp and stays longer than Gardevoir but that's about it. Granted, blocking those Pokemon is already half the meta. Unfortunately it's ruined by our new generalist/tank/GOAT Metagross, whom resists all of its moves. (It resists a majority of the Hidden Powers too)

Drifblim: When this.... blob is one of the best defenders, there's really something wrong. Nothing against it though, it walls Machamp, it can hit Dragons, and H/SB can take sizable chunks out of health bars. Unfortunately, with enough rapid tapping, Machamp still wins. But maybe it'll take another 30 seconds, tops?

Hippowodon: It has okay defensive coverage, and well rounded stats. It's the equivalent of Milotic (At least defender wise) being a different typing, blocking Rampardos and Raikou with ease. Stone Edge can hit like a truck and Body Slam fires fast and quickly as well. Perfect to be put after a Gyarados! Check my other post about all that. (Stone Edge hits Moltres/The Big 3 Dragons hard) Unfortunately for it, it's fast moves suck.

And that's all for "viable." Here's the other Pokemon that are F-Z tier.

Gallade: Another Gardevoir esque wall except it doesn't double resist Machamp. It's okay, but it may not even get a Psychic out before Machamp can defeat him. At least he's not weak to steel.

Bronzong: A discount Metagross, it resists many types and has "okay" bulk.

Lickyilicky: Why would you use him if you already have BlissLax and ChansKing in your gym?

Bastiodon: Oh look, another Aggron! Machamp, I choose you!

Rhyperior: Just another speed bump for Machamp. It does well against a lot of other opponents though, but it doesn't gel well with the normal type tanks. (And remember it's also doubly weak to Water AND Grass)

Yanmega: Might annoy Machamp slightly with it's good attack stat and double resistance, but it doesn't do much else.

Mismagius: It doubly resists Machamp, and has above average bulk, but it can't hit it super effectively and it only takes maybe 5 seconds longer to beat?

Asked by SleepySnorlax5 years 4 months ago
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Answers

by milkz 5 years 4 months ago

They seem lackluster because nothing in the series is gonna ever top Blissey and Chansey. Gen2 in the main series was all about bulky, slow monsters and it showed in Pokemon Go. From Gen3 onwards, we started to get more stronger attackers, as well as faster pokemon. If Legends were able to be put in gyms this topic wouldn't make sense as both Gen3 and Gen4 has great bulky legends in the Regis and Cresselia.

It doesn't even matter that much anyways. The whole gym system is a joke regardless. I personally like to throw in unique, interesting mons to show off. Don't care if I get kicked, as long as I get my 50 coins I'm happy.

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The CP rework would have taken chansey out of the ecuation and ended Blissey's god status. Why is not here after being announced a month ago? IDK

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by Peach 5 years 4 months ago

Defending :)

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Even from your discussion, the effectiveness of upcoming defenders seems to have less to do with the Pokémon themselves and more to do with the current meta.

Many folks will tell you the gym meta is unchallenging for anyone with a decent roster. A new gen brings more defenders along with more power creep - with the current meta, any gym can be easily dismantled if you have the correct counters.

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That always depends on the player base in a particular place. Around my work there are too many L40 hardcore players and except for berry feeding there's nothing to hold on to regardless of your gym strategy, but in nearby shopping center it's really funny. I've seen my full-hearts Blissey get +3 victories without a drop in motivation, which means the person who tried failed to beat it within 1 minute...

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At this point I get the feeling that Niantic is treating gyms the way they were implemented in the actual games. You fight a gym, you get a badge, yadda yadda, but you never encountered legendary mons in gyms. And why should you? The gym leaders weren't the main character, so it wouldn't make sense. This means you and your legendary mons can just roll right over a gym, same as you could in the main games. Our gym meta is just based on people's futile attempts to make gyms as hard to take down as possible.

PvP is gonna be a far more diverse and developed meta at first, but it'll slowly get solved just like it did in the main games. In GO's case itll be even worse though, since PvP will likely just be dictated by TDO + how good your network connection is.

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"generalist/tank/GOAT Metagross"

What the heck is a GOAT?

Agree with others, gym system is a joke, just throw in blissey, metagross, gardevoir and someone's bound to add a dragonite and tyranitar and someone throws in Slaking because they dont know its trash. Togekiss at the very least will finally put gardevoir out of our misery for good, doing everything it can do and more on defense, as well as possibly even more on offense.

Most of the pokemon in the game will likely fond spots in PvP teams if legendaries are banned/limited, people will experiment more because you likely wont see what your opponents using before you battle, as well as the CP rebalance has the potential to rewrite most of the meta as we know it when it comes to defenders baring blissey

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by daltry 5 years 4 months ago

There is no such thing as gym defense other than golden raz.

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With the decreased GRB give out from raids, maybe not as much anymore if you dont have 100+ grb

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Gym at its current state ?
No gym defender is good enough, even Blissey. Only GRB help. But even with that if the attacker is stubborn enough or has a time and revive and potion (which is a lot at this time) to waste it will go down.
So putting a good defender at the mall, coffeshop, restaurant, etc is a bad idea anyway.
Old gym system is more challenging if you like gym battle, the current one is meh. And the old gym gonna be easier because of the counters that trainers have now, if it ever comeback
I stop doing gym battle now, get the 50 coin/day and i am done. If some trainer decided to defend it with GRB, so be it. Sometimes i tested their willingness to spend their GRB if i feel like it and has a time to spare.
Have 10k battle girl medal with the old gym system, now its only around 13k.

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Blissey and Chansey are going to be Nerfed soon, which means even a Gyarados can kill a Max cp Blissey at that point (I DARE YOU TRY IT NOW) and Chansey will become completely irrevalant.

Not a bad call if it actually happens.

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So I will finally be able to justify maxing out my 98% Magikarp?

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Gyarados is a great attacker even with Kyogre in the game. Why are you scared of maxing it out?

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I mean that you CANNOT kill a 3000+ cp blissey with a Kyogre, lest be a Gyarados no matter how much you put at it. You just CANNOT. I dare you try it, you really can't.

At this state 3000+ CP Blisseys are completely unbeatable in any form or way save for Machamp, Meteor Mash Metagross, Sky Attack Moltres, Dragonite and a select few other high dps attackers.

I've beaten 2900- with Luxray, Raikou or Frenzy plant Venusaur but if it is over 3000 do not think about it. It's just that bad, plain and simple.

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I’m pretty sure Kyogre is possible. As for Gyarados, it will be very tight, but should still be possible.
I’ll use a Vaporeon then.

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A level 30 Kyogre can easily take a maxed Blissey. I don't think you've actually tried.
Just looking at the top 24 maxed attackers into maxed Blissey, none of them take longer than 71 seconds to win and 16/24 get through without dying with dodge specials pro and realistic dodging settings.
There are dozens of pokemon capable of bringing Blissey down when maxed. Even Aggron and Vaporeon can do it.

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I've taken down a 3K+ Blissey with Aggron. Takes a long ass time (relatively speaking) but possible.

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Golden Raspberry is going to be the best defender in Gen 4 just like it was in Gen 3 .... investing in gym Defense is for suckers

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Sadly, its true. Thats why i only use Weather boosted mons( 30+) as defenders to save dut with only exception for one maxed Blissey to fear casuals and short- time players. Maybe will put 35 on some lucky for trolling, but its optional.

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It really depends on where one lives. There are many areas with fierce competition for coins.

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